Disable MVCC test suites

[Maxim Muzafarov]

Folks,

Since the vote of removing MVCC API [1] completes successfully can we
disable the MVCC suites?

[1] http://apache-ignite-developers.2346864.n4.nabble.com/RESULT-VOTE-Removing-MVCC-public-API-tp50705.html

On Mon, 7 Dec 2020 at 09:38, Ivan Pavlukhin <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Hi Igniters,
>
> > The feature is not production-ready, and I don't think it is used at all.
>
> Unfortunately, we cannot be sure that the feature is not used at all.
> I recall some threads on user list about it.
>
> I understand concerns of those who want to get rid of MVCC. And the
> feature seems to be abandoned today and only increases development
> complexity. So, I think that cleaning up MVCC code is a good idea if
> there is no benefit for the developer community to maintain it today.
> But I suppose such decision should be properly communicated with the
> user community.
>
> 2020-12-02 18:31 GMT+03:00, Alex Plehanov <[hidden email]>:
> > -1 for disabling test without removing the code. Current tests give us at
> > least "something works" status for the feature available to users, without
> > these tests, we can smoothly move to "totally unusable" status.
> > Complete removal of MVCC can be resource-consuming, but if we want to
> > disable tests at least we should hide the public MVCC API or totally
> > prohibit MVCC usage. Also, it can't be done in 2.x release due to backward
> > compatibility.
> >
> > ср, 2 дек. 2020 г. в 17:28, Nikolay Izhikov <[hidden email]>:
> >
> >> > Yes, it can be done. However, I don't think that we will get an
> >> agreement on that
> >>
> >> Let’s give it a try and see what happens :)
> >>
> >>
> >> > 2 дек. 2020 г., в 17:23, Вячеслав Коптилин <[hidden email]>
> >> написал(а):
> >> >
> >> >> Can you start the vote?
> >> > Yes, it can be done. However, I don't think that we will get an
> >> > agreement
> >> > on that (I just recall the previous discussion).
> >> > And so, we will not remove the MVCC code; on the other hand, nobody
> >> > will
> >> > support it in the future. We already at this point. This is just my
> >> humble
> >> > opinion.
> >> >
> >> >> It's strange turning off here the whole MVCC tests just because
> >> something
> >> > in the master branch was broken when in the second thread
> >> > On one side, it looks weird, I agree. On the other hand, nobody cares
> >> about
> >> > that and wants to fix tests. This is a stalemate, I think.
> >> >
> >> > Thanks,
> >> > S.
> >> >
> >> > ср, 2 дек. 2020 г. в 16:47, Maxim Muzafarov <[hidden email]>:
> >> >
> >> >> Slava,
> >> >>
> >> >> Can you start the vote?
> >> >>
> >> >> It's strange turning off here the whole MVCC tests just because
> >> >> something in the master branch was broken when in the second thread
> >> >> Community decide to continue MVCC support. Let's start the vote and
> >> >> see what happens.
> >> >>
> >> >> On Wed, 2 Dec 2020 at 16:39, Вячеслав Коптилин <
> >> [hidden email]>
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >>>
> >> >>>> It will be even worse if our users will face NPE or things like that
> >> >> in
> >> >>> the basic MVCC scenarios just because we don’t tests it.
> >> >>> The feature is not production-ready, and I don't think it is used at
> >> all.
> >> >>> Moreover, MVCC Cache 7, 8, 8, MVCC PDS 1, 2, 4 are already broken
> >> >>> (execution timeouts, flaky test, etc) and I haven't seen anyone who
> >> would
> >> >>> like to fix this.
> >> >>> Why should we waste every contributor's time? IMHO, MVCC suites are
> >> >> useless
> >> >>> and everyone just pushes "re-run possible blockers" button and
> >> >>> doesn't
> >> >> care
> >> >>> about MVCC tests at all.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Thanks,
> >> >>> S.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> ср, 2 дек. 2020 г. в 16:01, Nikolay Izhikov <[hidden email]>:
> >> >>>
> >> >>>>> I think test suites can be disabled even today
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> I’m -1 to disable tests without complete removal.
> >> >>>> It will be even worse if our users will face NPE or things like that
> >> in
> >> >>>> the basic MVCC scenarios just because we don’t tests it.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>> 2 дек. 2020 г., в 15:50, Вячеслав Коптилин
> >> >>>>> <[hidden email]
> >> >>>
> >> >>>> написал(а):
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> Hi Nikolay,
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>> Why do we need feature in the project that not even tested
> >> >> regularly?
> >> >>>>> Fair enough. However, I am not an expert in this area (MVCC and
> >> >> SQL), so
> >> >>>> I
> >> >>>>> cannot say how much effort it will take.
> >> >>>>> I would say that the opinion of the rest of the community is needed
> >> >> here.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> Anyway, I think test suites can be disabled even today, while the
> >> >> fate of
> >> >>>>> the MVCC feature can be (and should be) discussed separately.
> >> >>>>> What do you think?
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> Thanks,
> >> >>>>> S.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> ср, 2 дек. 2020 г. в 15:38, Nikolay Izhikov <[hidden email]>:
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>> Hello, Slava!
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>> Yes, this topic comes to the top from time to time :)
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>> . I just want to save the time required for getting TCBot's visa
> >> >> and TC
> >> >>>>>> resources.
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>> Why do we need feature in the project that not even tested
> >> >> regularly?
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>> 2 дек. 2020 г., в 15:36, Вячеслав Коптилин <
> >> >> [hidden email]>
> >> >>>>>> написал(а):
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>> Hello Nikolay,
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>> +1 to vote for complete MVCC removal.
> >> >>>>>>> It has already been discussed here [1] and, unfortunately, I have
> >> >> not
> >> >>>>>> seen
> >> >>>>>>> an agreement on that.
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>> [1]
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>
> >> http://apache-ignite-developers.2346864.n4.nabble.com/Mark-MVCC-with-IgniteExperimental-td45669.html
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>> Thanks,
> >> >>>>>>> S.
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>> ср, 2 дек. 2020 г. в 13:05, Nikolay Izhikov
> >> >>>>>>> <[hidden email]>:
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>> +1 to vote for complete MVCC removal.
> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>> MVCC is a great feature but we should implement it as a
> >> >> first-class
> >> >>>>>>>> feature and not «something that pretends to be working»
> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>> 2 дек. 2020 г., в 12:53, Maxim Muzafarov <[hidden email]>
> >> >>>>>> написал(а):
> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>> Hello Slava,
> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>> I think we should vote for MVCC termination of support. If the
> >> >> vote
> >> >>>>>>>>> will be successful than remove it from the source code and
> >> >> disable
> >> >>>>>>>>> MVCC suites.
> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>> Only disabling tests from MVCC sounds not good.
> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>> On Wed, 2 Dec 2020 at 12:32, Вячеслав Коптилин <
> >> >>>>>> [hidden email]>
> >> >>>>>>>> wrote:
> >> >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>>> Hello Igniters,
> >> >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>>> It looks like there is no activity related to maintaining or
> >> >>>>>> developing
> >> >>>>>>>> the
> >> >>>>>>>>>> MVCC feature.
> >> >>>>>>>>>> So, I see no reason to waste TeamCity resources. I propose to
> >> >>>> disable
> >> >>>>>>>> the
> >> >>>>>>>>>> corresponding test suites.
> >> >>>>>>>>>> This has already been discussed here as well [1].
> >> >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>>> [1]
> >> >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>
> >> http://apache-ignite-developers.2346864.n4.nabble.com/Mark-MVCC-with-IgniteExperimental-td45669.html
> >> >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
> >> >>>>>>>>>> S.
> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
> --
>
> Best regards,
> Ivan Pavlukhin

[Ivan Pavlukhin]

+

2021-02-06 0:50 GMT+03:00, Maxim Muzafarov <[hidden email]>:

> Folks,
>
> Since the vote of removing MVCC API [1] completes successfully can we
> disable the MVCC suites?
>
> [1]
> http://apache-ignite-developers.2346864.n4.nabble.com/RESULT-VOTE-Removing-MVCC-public-API-tp50705.html
>
> On Mon, 7 Dec 2020 at 09:38, Ivan Pavlukhin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Igniters,
>>
>> > The feature is not production-ready, and I don't think it is used at
>> > all.
>>
>> Unfortunately, we cannot be sure that the feature is not used at all.
>> I recall some threads on user list about it.
>>
>> I understand concerns of those who want to get rid of MVCC. And the
>> feature seems to be abandoned today and only increases development
>> complexity. So, I think that cleaning up MVCC code is a good idea if
>> there is no benefit for the developer community to maintain it today.
>> But I suppose such decision should be properly communicated with the
>> user community.
>>
>> 2020-12-02 18:31 GMT+03:00, Alex Plehanov <[hidden email]>:
>> > -1 for disabling test without removing the code. Current tests give us
>> > at
>> > least "something works" status for the feature available to users,
>> > without
>> > these tests, we can smoothly move to "totally unusable" status.
>> > Complete removal of MVCC can be resource-consuming, but if we want to
>> > disable tests at least we should hide the public MVCC API or totally
>> > prohibit MVCC usage. Also, it can't be done in 2.x release due to
>> > backward
>> > compatibility.
>> >
>> > ср, 2 дек. 2020 г. в 17:28, Nikolay Izhikov <[hidden email]>:
>> >
>> >> > Yes, it can be done. However, I don't think that we will get an
>> >> agreement on that
>> >>
>> >> Let’s give it a try and see what happens :)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> > 2 дек. 2020 г., в 17:23, Вячеслав Коптилин
>> >> > <[hidden email]>
>> >> написал(а):
>> >> >
>> >> >> Can you start the vote?
>> >> > Yes, it can be done. However, I don't think that we will get an
>> >> > agreement
>> >> > on that (I just recall the previous discussion).
>> >> > And so, we will not remove the MVCC code; on the other hand, nobody
>> >> > will
>> >> > support it in the future. We already at this point. This is just my
>> >> humble
>> >> > opinion.
>> >> >
>> >> >> It's strange turning off here the whole MVCC tests just because
>> >> something
>> >> > in the master branch was broken when in the second thread
>> >> > On one side, it looks weird, I agree. On the other hand, nobody
>> >> > cares
>> >> about
>> >> > that and wants to fix tests. This is a stalemate, I think.
>> >> >
>> >> > Thanks,
>> >> > S.
>> >> >
>> >> > ср, 2 дек. 2020 г. в 16:47, Maxim Muzafarov <[hidden email]>:
>> >> >
>> >> >> Slava,
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Can you start the vote?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> It's strange turning off here the whole MVCC tests just because
>> >> >> something in the master branch was broken when in the second thread
>> >> >> Community decide to continue MVCC support. Let's start the vote and
>> >> >> see what happens.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Wed, 2 Dec 2020 at 16:39, Вячеслав Коптилин <
>> >> [hidden email]>
>> >> >> wrote:
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>> It will be even worse if our users will face NPE or things like
>> >> >>>> that
>> >> >> in
>> >> >>> the basic MVCC scenarios just because we don’t tests it.
>> >> >>> The feature is not production-ready, and I don't think it is used
>> >> >>> at
>> >> all.
>> >> >>> Moreover, MVCC Cache 7, 8, 8, MVCC PDS 1, 2, 4 are already broken
>> >> >>> (execution timeouts, flaky test, etc) and I haven't seen anyone
>> >> >>> who
>> >> would
>> >> >>> like to fix this.
>> >> >>> Why should we waste every contributor's time? IMHO, MVCC suites
>> >> >>> are
>> >> >> useless
>> >> >>> and everyone just pushes "re-run possible blockers" button and
>> >> >>> doesn't
>> >> >> care
>> >> >>> about MVCC tests at all.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> Thanks,
>> >> >>> S.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> ср, 2 дек. 2020 г. в 16:01, Nikolay Izhikov <[hidden email]>:
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>> I think test suites can be disabled even today
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> I’m -1 to disable tests without complete removal.
>> >> >>>> It will be even worse if our users will face NPE or things like
>> >> >>>> that
>> >> in
>> >> >>>> the basic MVCC scenarios just because we don’t tests it.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>> 2 дек. 2020 г., в 15:50, Вячеслав Коптилин
>> >> >>>>> <[hidden email]
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>> написал(а):
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> Hi Nikolay,
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>>> Why do we need feature in the project that not even tested
>> >> >> regularly?
>> >> >>>>> Fair enough. However, I am not an expert in this area (MVCC and
>> >> >> SQL), so
>> >> >>>> I
>> >> >>>>> cannot say how much effort it will take.
>> >> >>>>> I would say that the opinion of the rest of the community is
>> >> >>>>> needed
>> >> >> here.
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> Anyway, I think test suites can be disabled even today, while
>> >> >>>>> the
>> >> >> fate of
>> >> >>>>> the MVCC feature can be (and should be) discussed separately.
>> >> >>>>> What do you think?
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> Thanks,
>> >> >>>>> S.
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> ср, 2 дек. 2020 г. в 15:38, Nikolay Izhikov
>> >> >>>>> <[hidden email]>:
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>>> Hello, Slava!
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>> Yes, this topic comes to the top from time to time :)
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>> . I just want to save the time required for getting TCBot's
>> >> >>>>>>> visa
>> >> >> and TC
>> >> >>>>>> resources.
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>> Why do we need feature in the project that not even tested
>> >> >> regularly?
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>> 2 дек. 2020 г., в 15:36, Вячеслав Коптилин <
>> >> >> [hidden email]>
>> >> >>>>>> написал(а):
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>> Hello Nikolay,
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> +1 to vote for complete MVCC removal.
>> >> >>>>>>> It has already been discussed here [1] and, unfortunately, I
>> >> >>>>>>> have
>> >> >> not
>> >> >>>>>> seen
>> >> >>>>>>> an agreement on that.
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>> [1]
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>
>> >> http://apache-ignite-developers.2346864.n4.nabble.com/Mark-MVCC-with-IgniteExperimental-td45669.html
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>> Thanks,
>> >> >>>>>>> S.
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>> ср, 2 дек. 2020 г. в 13:05, Nikolay Izhikov
>> >> >>>>>>> <[hidden email]>:
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> +1 to vote for complete MVCC removal.
>> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> MVCC is a great feature but we should implement it as a
>> >> >> first-class
>> >> >>>>>>>> feature and not «something that pretends to be working»
>> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>> 2 дек. 2020 г., в 12:53, Maxim Muzafarov <[hidden email]>
>> >> >>>>>> написал(а):
>> >> >>>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>> Hello Slava,
>> >> >>>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>> I think we should vote for MVCC termination of support. If
>> >> >>>>>>>>> the
>> >> >> vote
>> >> >>>>>>>>> will be successful than remove it from the source code and
>> >> >> disable
>> >> >>>>>>>>> MVCC suites.
>> >> >>>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>> Only disabling tests from MVCC sounds not good.
>> >> >>>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>> On Wed, 2 Dec 2020 at 12:32, Вячеслав Коптилин <
>> >> >>>>>> [hidden email]>
>> >> >>>>>>>> wrote:
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> Hello Igniters,
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> It looks like there is no activity related to maintaining
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> or
>> >> >>>>>> developing
>> >> >>>>>>>> the
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> MVCC feature.
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> So, I see no reason to waste TeamCity resources. I propose
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> to
>> >> >>>> disable
>> >> >>>>>>>> the
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> corresponding test suites.
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> This has already been discussed here as well [1].
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> [1]
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>
>> >> http://apache-ignite-developers.2346864.n4.nabble.com/Mark-MVCC-with-IgniteExperimental-td45669.html
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> S.
>> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Ivan Pavlukhin
>

--

Best regards,
Ivan Pavlukhin